Speaker 1: 0:01

Welcome to the Husband Material podcast, where we help Christian men outgrow porn. Why? So you can change your brain, heal your heart and save your relationship. My name is Drew Boa and I'm here to show you how let's go. Hey man, thank you for listening to my interview with Ken Freire. He has an amazing story of going from shame, sexual abuse and so much anger to identity in Christ and joy. And you're not only going to hear Ken's story. You will hear some wonderful wisdom from the Word of God. That's such a great foundation to outgrow porn and find lasting freedom. Enjoy the episode. Today I'm hanging out with Ken Freire. I'm so excited to have him on the show. I got to be on his podcast, which is called Shameless. It's a great resource. You should go check it out. Welcome, ken.

Speaker 2: 0:57

Hey Drew, thank you so much for having me on the podcast, and kudos to you, man, for nailing my last name. That's a feat within itself, so we're off to a good start.

Speaker 1: 1:07

Awesome, Ken. Why are you so passionate about freedom from porn and shame?

Speaker 2: 1:13

Yeah, you know I was addicted to porn since the age of five and I know we'll dig into that quite a bit today. But the biggest thing was that I see so many men who are addicted to pornography or who have been stuck in the cycle of shame that at the end of the day, they don't end up seeing their greatest potential or their God-given purpose. And I believe that God has called us that if we can break free from shame and break free from this addiction, we'll see greater men in society, we'll see greater husbands, we'll see great fathers, and that's what we need today in this world where it feels crooked and depraved and so dark and everything that you hear is all about toxic masculinity and just how people don't know how to be themselves fully, what God has called them to be. People don't know how to be themselves fully what God has called them to be. So I'm just super excited to share how God has shaped me, how God has formed me to really be a vessel for his glory.

Speaker 1: 2:10

I love that, Ken, as you look back on your story, even to the age of five. How did this all start for you?

Speaker 2: 2:19

Yeah, unfortunately for me, you know, it started because I was sexually abused when I was younger. For me, you know, it started because I was sexually abused when I was younger, so from like the age of three to five, and the person who introduced me to pornography was the same person who had abused me. So it skewed my worldview on sexual ethics and what sexuality should look like for a man, and for years I was well. The first few years I was actually just repressing all of those emotions, all those feelings. I was like I don't even want to think about this stuff. I don't know if this actually happened.

Speaker 2: 2:53

It might've just been some figment of my imagination, but the reality is that I started to come to grips with it and I became really angry individual.

Speaker 2: 3:04

And it wasn't like it was happening every day or anything like that, but there were multiple occasions throughout those years that I just remember vividly what had happened to me and how I was touched and how I was forced to do things to other individuals, and that just shaped my view of really what I thought manhood should look like. I had a very broken identity for years and in fact, if I'm honest with myself, it's still something that God is walking me through and helping me every day to learn more and more of how should I walk in my identity in Christ. But for years, man, I just suffered. You know I think the best way to put it is I used to tell people from more of Hispanic culture is kind of more patriarchal culture, right? I was like I had this massive issue where I was like manhood was all about being tough, being strong, being firm, being able to be like the captain. You're like the head honcho.

Speaker 2: 3:59

Maybe, like machismo, machismo, yeah, yeah, right, and I was just like, but for me I felt like the complete opposite. I felt like worthless. I felt completely scared. I felt completely hurtful. When I looked in the mirror, I was just a little boy who was abused and everyone would take advantage of me, and I was bullied. When I was younger, I felt like I just had all these stigmas of what manhood should look like, and then they were gone. You know, because of my scarred view and what had happened to me. Really, you know all the suffering that I had incurred. All of a sudden, I was just like man. I can never achieve that type of manhood, even if I wanted to.

Speaker 2: 4:42

I'm starting at negative 10 in the race where some people might start at five or two. You know, I was like I'm disqualified. So for a long time I just felt disqualified and I think a lot of men today feel disqualified and it might not be because of abuse, but it might just be because of their porn addiction, right, and that men. Those two things just spiraled me into this guilt and shame of like me trying to earn my identity, when it's not something I earn, it's something that's given to me by the grace of God through forgiveness and redemption. But like I didn't know that back then, so I just tried to do as much as possible to try to gain favor from God and from others, when I knew deep down I was struggling with something much, much more insidious and torturous from the suffering that I had heard.

Speaker 1: 5:28

Your story is a great example of what we say at Husband Material. It's not men who get hooked on porn, it's boys. So we need to heal the boy, to free the man. When did things start to change for you?

Speaker 2: 5:42

Things actually got worse before they got better, and I tell that to people all the time in their healing journey that sometimes it gets worse before it gets better. I, around the age of 12 and 14, I started to really recognize the pain that happened to me and I was angry at God. First and foremost, I was like God, why would you let this happen to a little boy? And if you're in a theological spheres, that's called theodicy, right, the problem of pain, the problem of suffering, and that was my biggest pain point of actually rejecting God, because I just didn't understand what was going on. So for me, the biggest thing that I had to work through was just this reality of like God. I'm so mad that this happened and you allowed it, so I'm just going to reject everything that you're about. And I just ran full force into debauchery and sin so fast forward to the age of 16. I mean, I was already sexually active, I was still addicted to pornography, I was manipulating women, I was doing just about anything I really wanted to, and what I thought God would hate I did. At the age of 16, I slept with someone and it went really horrible. I contracted an STD and I just like life was horrible and I was still angry at God. And here's the funny thing when you are suffering from something that happened to you like me, I had a wound, someone hurt me Because I wasn't me. I had a wound, someone hurt me Because I wasn't healed, I in turn hurt other people. So I just remember being in a really rock bottom place, that at the age of 16, I decided to end my life and I was getting ready to commit suicide and this is a long story so I'm just trying to condense it into a concise point. But that night, when I was going to end my life, god radically came into my room and met me there.

Speaker 2: 7:32

I just felt the complete despair and frustration and hopelessness that this world sucks and there's so much pain, so much sin, so much suffering and I just couldn't escape it. And I would have all these spiritual, demonic nightmares. For those who have been abused, this is very common where they have these nightmares, ongoing, nightmares of like feeling like, oh my gosh, they're repeating these same stories, or like almost demons attacking them. Like I had all of that stuff going on in my life since the age of five to 16. And I just remember just crying out to God saying God, why me Like, why this, this is horrible? Like I don't have any joy. There was no hope in my heart. All I felt was just agony. Hope in my heart, all I felt was just agony, and the only escape that I thought was just end my life, just be done with it, because that seems way better, right, having no feelings seems way better than having all these negative feelings that I was struggling with. And that's when God man, he just broke in.

Speaker 2: 8:41

You know, I tell people all the time sometimes they might not be in like the charismatic world, and I don't sometimes even know how to explain it, but it was the first time, and very few times I ever feel like I heard the audible voice of God in my room and he said to me this passage in scripture, which I didn't know back then, I wasn't memorizing scripture. Clearly from my story, right, I wasn't memorizing scripture, but this is what I heard in, like I felt like he was talking to me, like you're talking to me right now. He said, ken, do not be discouraged, do not be dismayed, but be strong and courageous, for the lord, your god, is with you wherever you go. And for those of you who know that passage is joshua 1 9. And I remember for the first time just crying like you know that like snot nose, kind of crying, like all of it gunk, everything like for hours, torture, that I was feeling. The one thing that I was truly crying out for is for someone to see me and someone to know me and someone to hear me. And it was the first time I felt like God was hearing me and anybody heard me and just like, oh my gosh, he's like, do not be discouraged, do not be dismayed, but be strong and courageous, for the Lord, your God, is with you. And I remember, like, thinking like, lord, you're with me, like, are you sure? Like, and I wrestled through it, man, I mean, I was really wrestling, like, really, were you Like, were you there when I was being abused? Were you there when I felt lonely? Were you there when I was angry? Were you there, like hours of me just crying out to God? But I couldn't explain the theological aspect back then. Now I have better language for it.

Speaker 2: 10:26

But what I do know is that it was a stepping stone, the shift for me to say God, thank you, I'm going to be with you. This is going to be a really hard journey. I'm going to be with you. This is going to be a really hard journey. I'm going to have a lot of questions for you, but I want to know you more, and if you're the only one who can heal me, then so be it. But let's take this baby steps, because I don't know how else to do it. I don't fully trust you yet, god, but I'm going to start, since I had this massive breakthrough in my room that night, so that was a turning point. I had to hit rock bottom before I could actually turn.

Speaker 1: 10:58

You were 16 years old after that turning point. What happened next?

Speaker 2: 11:05

It actually took a few years, from 16 to probably 19, where I was really struggling. And this is probably where most people who are in husband material might feel right, like they know they should be doing the right thing, but they're struggling to go in two steps forward, one step backwards. And that's exactly where I was all the time, and a part of it was I was doing it alone. I wasn't getting any people involved in my story. I didn't share my story with anyone. You know, at this point I haven't told anyone my story. It was just between me and God. And for those of you who are listening to this, you may be in that same situation where you're like, hey, I'm in this community, but I haven't really shared my story with anyone yet, I'm just going to keep it to myself and God. That is probably one of the hardest positions for you to put yourself in, because you're seeing other people get hope and you think that if you're just around them you might get freedom. But that's not how it works. Shame is undone when you reveal its secrets. Amen, right, and this is why, for those of you who are in Drew's community, I implore you share, find the people that you trust If you need to go to Drew or one of Drew's coaches, man, do it. It will literally be one of the biggest things that you could do for your freedom. And Drew, that's what happened to me, man, I remember for those few years I battled and then, when I was 19, I moved, actually from New York City that's where I was born and raised. I moved to Texas and I found a counselor there. He was a good counselor and he radically just walked me through baby steps. And I'm telling you I needed the baby steps because part of the story that I skipped is that when, at the age of 16, the thing that made me want to end my life was that I thought to myself I know, I'm in a bad place, I need help, so the only way to get help is if I tell someone. So I went to a counselor to try to share my story. And this counselor, all they said to me was, after I shared all my sin, all my problems, everything they're like. Well, ken, I'm hearing you and I think, honestly, the reason why you guys did all this was just because they were bored and you were bored. So you were just testing things out and I'm like gosh, testing things out. I was like that was that, that's not what people, kids, do I mean, I have four kids like that's not what you do, right, and I was just dude. I like I took everything in my power not to punch this counselor in the face because I just felt completely unheard, completely ignored, completely like oh, here's a pat answer Just go walk away, you're fine. But this is all 16 years of frustration and I'm sure, drew, you've heard this from a lot of people in your community. So then this counselor fast forward to this great counselor that I met, man. He just walked with me Baby steps, a couple of big steps that he walked me through at the age of 19.

Speaker 2: 14:00

Number one was forgiveness. I had to walk through a lot of just what true forgiveness looks like, not just the superficial forgiveness. The second thing was learning my identity. That was such a big thing for me, drew, because honestly, like what we talked about earlier, I just didn't know who I was, what my identity looked like. So he walked me through identity. And then the third one was he just walked me through purpose, like genuine, like what is my God-given purpose.

Speaker 2: 14:29

What I have found most men where they get stuck in their healing journey is that they so much focus on the past that they don't actually look at the future. And it's both right, like God saves us from something to something. You need to do both right. You need to be healed right, heal the boy right, like you need that. And then, when you become a man, you need to actually start walking into your God-given purpose. So, well said, don't just stay there. And that's where most people man. You need to actually start walking into your God-given purpose. So, well said, don't just stay there. And that's where most people get stuck is they stay there and then they're like, oh, why did I relapse? It's because you're acting like a boy when you're supposed to be a man.

Speaker 1: 15:06

Yeah, it's true, and we often don't realize the ways that that's happening. Ken, you once shared with me a breakthrough or an insight that you had about a pattern that was playing out on Saturday mornings that you didn't realize was rooted in childhood.

Speaker 2: 15:28

You know, when you're in porn addiction you cope a lot of different ways. But here's the thing about pornography for most people we use that as a big umbrella. But underneath pornography there's all these types of porn that people watch, right. That's where the shame is right, because we know most men they watch porn, right. Like, statistically speaking, most men watch porn and they're like oh yeah, I've seen it once or twice.

Speaker 1: 15:52

And at this point to say the word porn doesn't actually mean that much. We need to get particular. The power is in the particularity.

Speaker 2: 16:03

Because that's where judgment comes right. That's where the judgment feels like oh, you watch S&M, oh, you're watching same-sex attraction porn. Oh, you're watching bestiality. Oh you're watching this, oh you have this fetish. Like that's where people start to feel like, oh my gosh. And interesting enough, that counselor one of the things that he did we did a group coaching conversation with a group of men and I remember one of the most freeing moments was he just kind of went through a list of all the different types of pornography out there at the time and, very matter of fact, he wasn't trying to shame me, he was like but here's what it is and here's how you may feel right and why you're watching this type of porn. And it was just so insightful and like the freedom that people had.

Speaker 2: 16:51

So fast forward to our conversation. Um, we were talking about childhood and like how sometimes you may have some childhood rejection and you cope a different way. And somehow you and I got into conversations of like Saturday morning cartoons. I don't even exactly remember how we got into it, but you said something that I just remember thinking to myself oh my gosh, the porn that I struggled with a lot when I was younger was was hentai and if, for those of you who don't know what that is, that's like anime porn, right, like that's cartoon porn. However you want to look at it, my coping mechanism was escape. I wanted to escape to a place where I felt safe. And for me, the moments where I felt the safest as I remember as a little kid was sitting in my room watching Saturday morning cartoons and I just remember thinking like this is it, this is the safest thing, all these cartoons that I could think about.

Speaker 1: 17:45

It's another world where none of this abuse and pain and shame is happening.

Speaker 2: 17:52

That gave you an escape and it makes so much sense that you would be drawn to porn that maybe felt similar through anime exactly I knew big picture porn was the thing that I went to, for comfort, for escape, for satisfaction right, there's so many things that I was trying to cope for, for some sort of semblance of ecstatic joy, right, where that wasn't my home life, that wasn't my personal life right, I went to it.

Speaker 2: 18:24

But then, when you and I were talking about it, it was one of those things of like oh my gosh is also for safety, and this is the only time I remember being safe was watching anime or cartoons, and this is why I was pursuing anime, and it was just one of those things where, like you know, I haven't watched anime or hentai in like 15 plus years, but just to even see it in my own life. So, for those of you who are listening to this, I've been free from porn for 16 plus years. Now I still am being revealed how God is shaping me and forming me and how certain triggers I had were caused by certain things, and now I'm able to analyze it a lot better, like, oh, this is why I'm stressed out about this. Let's deal with it appropriately.

Speaker 1: 19:08

I love that so much and like praise God for 16 plus years of freedom, and also not just freedom from those behaviors, but freedom for who you are and what you're doing now. Yeah, 100%.

Speaker 2: 19:21

And if anything, for the guys who are listening to this, that's the thing I want them to walk away with is like who can you become right and who has God destined you to be? And listen very carefully. I'm not saying what are you going to do right now, but it's just who are you going to be? Being comes before doing, and so many times we get that backwards because we try to find men as men. We try to find our identity in what we do, not who we are. When I started to understand what identity in Christ looked like, to understand what identity in Christ looked like, I grabbed hold of it so tight Because I realized that my identity doesn't come from who I am or what I do, or what I'm capable of, or the giftings or the skill sets. It's solely by who he created me to be. I am made in the image of God and when I put my trust and faith in him, he redeems me. And all of a sudden he says you are a child of God, you are now in co-heir, you are a royal priesthood. And for me, like Ephesians 1, 3 to 4 says this like before the foundations of the earth, we are called pure and blameless, like men I'm going to get a little excited here. Hopefully you guys are okay with this Like for us to be called holy and blameless.

Speaker 2: 20:39

Think about that For those of you who struggle with pornography. You see yourself as dirty, you see yourself as worthless, you see yourself as ugly. And he's like you are holy. That means you're set apart. You are blameless. That means that there's no imperfections. When God sees you, he sees perfection, he sees beauty, not because you're good. He sees the imputation of Christ. He sees Christ through you and he's like you're my son and I love you and you're pure and you're clean. You're not dirty. And for me, for someone who was abused, who was like I felt broken, I felt completely destroyed, I felt completely dismayed and I just didn't know who I was to be told. Hey, you are worthy because of what Christ has done. You are clean because of who Christ is. You are holy because that's what I've called you to do. It was radical and that's what I see now and that's what I think most men need in their life today.

Speaker 1: 21:36

It changes everything 100%. We fall into this mindset that what I do determines who I am good or bad. But the truth of the gospel is that who you are determines what you do determines what you do, in the sense that when we see ourselves as Jesus sees us, we start to live in alignment with that.

Speaker 2: 22:08

Once I started getting healing, one of the things that my counselor walked me through is find other men who you can start helping them in the journey. And so for the last 15 years I've been helping men overcome freedom from pornography and also from just abuse. Just because of my story, I understand it more intimately that I can help most men. But one of the things that I walk through men in their journey first and foremost, it's not actually like here's all these behavior modification things that you need to do, here's a rubber band and put it on your wrist and slap None of that. Honestly, what I do is I say and put it on your wrist and slap None of that. Honestly, what I do is I say let's walk through your identity in Christ For 30 days. Let's just figure out who you are and get you to memorize scripture of who you are in Christ. I'll give you a fun story of how this worked.

Speaker 2: 22:53

I remember I was walking with a guy. He was struggling with porn addiction. He didn't know why and I just met him. I didn't know his story and I was just hanging out with him. I'm like why do you feel like you are so stuck in pornography? And he said to me Ken, I just feel like I'm dirty and I'm completely unworthy of God's grace. I just feel like I'm dirty and I'm completely unworthy of God's grace. I'm like okay, this is good. Can we do a quick 10-minute exercise here in the coffee shop? I promise it won't feel weird. He's like sure. I said grab your Bible and let's just read it.

Speaker 2: 23:27

I quoted Ephesians 1, 3, or 4 earlier. I said let's just read it. So he just read it and he's like okay, cool, now what? I'm like, read it again. He's like I read it. I'm like okay, cool, read it again. And he's like you're getting weird. I'm like just read it out loud, like three or four more times and probably within the sixth time he just started crying right there in the coffee shop, unbeknownst, like I didn't do anything.

Speaker 2: 23:56

I was just having him read the passage and I said and I of course knew why he was crying, right, but I said hey, man, what's going on? He's like this is the first time and I'm just going to tear up because it's so beautiful to see all the time. It's like this is the first time that I actually see and hear that God said I'm see, and hear that God said I'm pure and I'm blameless and I'm worthy. He's like. He's like this is who I am and he's like getting excited at a coffee shop. He's like he's like this is who I am and I'm like exactly.

Speaker 2: 24:34

And then I said now here's what's going to happen. You're going to get in your car, you're going to be really ecstatic, but the enemy is going to try to attack you. So for the next 30 days, we just need to hit this hard and there's all these scriptures, all these passages in the Bible that talks about who you are in Christ, and we just need to get you to a place where you're memorizing that, you're living that out Because, trust me, when you start to think and believe in who you actually are, you're not going to want to do those things. You're going to live out who you believe you're called to. Most men they fall back into pornography because they're like well, because I feel unclean and I believe, and I'm unclean and I'm unworthy and I'm a lustful being, then I'm just going to go do those lustful things and it's like well, no, no, no. If you are a child of God, you're going to go do things a child of God does.

Speaker 1: 25:17

It's like when I go into my room and if my room is totally clean, I don't want to make a mess on the floor, and I feel like something similar happens with our identity 100%.

Speaker 2: 25:29

You know, I think about Romans, chapter 6. He says reckon yourself, that's kind of like old school terminology. But New York translation says, uh, reckon yourself, that's kind of like old school terminology. But, um, new York translation says, like, consider yourself dead to sin and alive in Christ and alive to righteousness. And it's like, well, when you're alive, like, what do you do? You? You do the things that alive people do. You don't do things that people do, and I think a lot of times, pornography is what dead people do, not alive people do, right, and I love that analogy of like.

Speaker 2: 25:59

I can't tell you how many times I go into, like, a guest's house, right, and it's really clean. Well, what's the first thing you do when you walk into someone's clean house? You like take off your shoes because you're like, I don't want to mess this up, right, but how many of you have ever gone to a place that's a little dirty and you could tell like their carpets, and that's like you don't care, like you're just going to keep your shoes on? Your natural instinct is, oh, this is fine, I'm going to live this way and this is what god's called us to. He's like no, no, you're actually clean and this is, if anything, the hardest thing for people who are christians and believe in jesus that, like god actually says, you clean. That's the hardest thing for them to believe, because they believe they're dirty.

Speaker 1: 26:38

Yeah, john, 15, three. You are already clean because of the word I've spoken to you.

Speaker 2: 26:43

Yeah, and that's the thing that I'm always constantly telling men like no, no, see yourself the way God sees you.

Speaker 1: 26:49

And that's why I always end every episode saying always remember you are God's beloved son. In you he is well-pleased. I love it. And as we're talking about identity in Christ, some of you guys might be thinking well, I don't feel that way. I can't experience what you're talking about. Oftentimes, the beliefs that we have about who we are are not just intellectual, they're in our bodies, they've been shaped by our stories and that's why it's a both and of the deeper healing work that engages our childhood and our sexual fantasies, and also getting this foundation that Ken is talking about at a heart level, like that guy in the coffee shop who was just saying it over and over again, but eventually it sank into his heart, and that's where the healing and transformation really starts to gain momentum do you remember in the the lion king, when, uh, simba's like looking into the mirror, into the water, oh right.

Speaker 2: 27:52

And mufasa's like remember, right, simba?

Speaker 2: 27:56

remember who you are Right and it's just like bro. I watched that movie. I think you and I were actually texting each other back and forth a while back, but it was during the holidays and my sons were watching, my kids were watching it for Christmas and, dude, I started crying and they're like what's wrong? Because it's just, it's actually such a powerful scene for adults and I'm like that's who I am. You know, like my son is like my son is so chill, he's just sitting there. He's like what's wrong with you? I'm like nothing's wrong, buddy.

Speaker 1: 28:30

I'm clean, I'm pure.

Speaker 2: 28:33

I'm pure. But so going back to that analogy of like the water was clean enough for him to actually see. But bitterness muddies everything and that's where, for many of most men, sometimes we do have to look at our childhood, we do have to look at our past and we probably have to go through a forgiveness of anybody who hurt us. And here's the thing For some of you who are listening to this thank God you didn't have to go through my story. That's not you, but you're like well, I didn't go through that thing, so I guess I don't know what the path is. I'm not that messed up, but you'd feel the same way. This is where Drew and I we've talked about. It doesn't matter, my suffering doesn't have to equate to your suffering. All of us have suffered. All of us have had some sort of rejection, some sort of pain, some sort of wound, some sort of acceptance that we have to walk through and forgive those individuals.

Speaker 1: 29:27

And I would argue that anyone who encountered porn at an early age is a survivor of childhood sexual abuse. Porn vandalizes our sexuality from such a young age. I think in many ways porn is an abuser Porn itself definitely violates us. Right, so we all have healing work to do.

Speaker 2: 29:49

Yes, Step one is just feeling like you're not alone in this crazy world and like there are people around you and I know, Drew, you've created a great community of people and men who are trying to do this together.

Speaker 1: 30:05

Yes, and together. When we share our stories and bring our deepest shame into the light, it loses its power and porn doesn't have to control us anymore. Ken, what is your favorite thing about freedom from porn?

Speaker 2: 30:23

Oh man, my favorite thing is the incredible joy that I have day in and day out. When we talk about freedom, right, you're like, oh, I want to be free from this thing. I had a great. I had a guest on my podcast that he put it really well. He said, ken, when I was stuck in porn, what I felt like I was always living a double life, I was hiding things and I always had to set up plans to make sure that I was never getting caught. And he's like, now that I'm free, he's like I could just be myself. I don't have to hide, there's not the stressor of it. He's like I could just be fully present. And for me, that fully present meant that I am full of a lot of joy. You know, when I got rid of all the bitterness and I found my identity and I started walking my purpose, man, I'm really excited, I'm really joyful.

Speaker 2: 31:19

Drew, if you would have met me when I was 16, I was very angry. I mean, there was a lot Like my face always looked like I wanted to stab someone. But I was like 16 and weighed 100 pounds. I was like a little chihuahua, all right, like I wasn't killing anybody or hurting anything. Now, when people meet me, it's like I'm always laughing, I'm always happy, I'm full of joy.

Speaker 2: 31:37

Why? Because, like man, I know what God has done for me and it's just like I want to share that with everybody. And my kids don't see an angry dad, they see a joyful dad and that's what I love. They're like oh, my dad's, because that's what I wanted. So when you talk about what is the freedom man? Just full of joy, fully seeing who God is being in his presence. Psalm 1611 says in his presence there's fullness of joy. It's not a feeling. I know because it says it in Hebrews where I could just enter the throne room of grace and that's where I'm at. It's just a place where I'm confident in who I am as a son. I'm confident in who I am as a son.

Speaker 1: 32:15

I'm confident in who God has made me to be that I could come to him anytime and I could share that with others. Praise God, ken. Thank you so much for sharing your story and for hosting your podcast. You guys can find it the Shameless Podcast. Where can people go to hear more from you?

Speaker 2: 32:43

Yeah, so I actually have a website called scripturesblog, right, that's where they can find, uh, the shameless podcast. And then also, I'm on all social media platforms. You just go to kenfrede on Instagram or or Facebook or LinkedIn. I'm on all major social media platforms. Would love to hang out with you guys again. That's kenfredere F-R-E-I-R-E. It's a tongue twister. Drew killed it. The first time he said it, I was like, wow, that was impressive.

Speaker 1: 33:06

Well, it shows you that I grew up in Puerto Rico and Mexico.

Speaker 2: 33:09

Yeah, no, I mean bro, seriously, like anytime people I tell them my last name, they're like and you were just like. Oh, I'm like dang, bro, that's what I'm talking about.

Speaker 1: 33:20

You got me really excited. Well, your joy is contagious. So guys go down to the links in the show notes If you want to connect with Ken and always remember you are God's beloved son in you, he is well pleased. Let me say that again A few more more times just because of this interview. Let it sink in you are God's beloved son In you. He is well-pleased. You are God's beloved son In you. He is well-placed.