Speaker 1 0:01

Welcome to the Husband Material podcast , where we help Christian men outgrow porn . Why ? So you can change your brain , heal your heart and save your relationship . My name is Drew Boa and I'm here to show you how let's go . Hey , my name is Drew . I'm the founder of Husband Material , where I help men

What is a sexual fetish?

Speaker 1 0:23

outgrow porn . Today we are talking about fetishes .

Speaker 1 0:28

Have you ever had a sexual fetish ? A sexual fetish is something very specific in particular that you find sexually irresistible . It's part of a person rather than a whole person . It could be an object , it could be a body part . In my case , I have had a sexual fetish for braces and orthodontics . This is the type of porn and sexual fantasy that always appealed to me .

Speaker 1 0:53

Sometimes men ask me can my arousal template change ? Can we switch out what I'm sexually attracted to for something else ? And when I hear that , my heart breaks because every sexual fetish or sexual attraction or point of arousal is a part of you that is not bad , but good . Now , what it is doing can be very damaging , but that part of you , just like an emotion , is not bad , it's good . We need to learn how to embrace our emotions and express them in healthy ways . In the same way . I really believe we need to be able to accept our sexual arousal , listen to what it's trying to tell us and ultimately use it for healing . That's what this episode is all about , and as you heal , as a byproduct , you may experience a shift in those sexual feelings which can make it so much easier to get lasting freedom . So in this episode even though I hesitate to share it because it does feel extremely vulnerable I want to tell my story . I want to be honest about what I've experienced and , at the same time , acknowledge that your experience might be different , and that's okay .

Speaker 1 2:10

From a young age , I was always attracted to girls and women with braces , and when I got braces , I was sexually attracted to myself , which felt really weird . And yet , over the last few years , this fetish has lost so much of its power , and that has made freedom from porn and unwanted sexual behavior so much easier . Now let me be clear . I would say that my sexual fetish has become less intense , less frequent , less disruptive and even less arousing , but it did not get removed , it did not get replaced . In fact , just recently , one week ago , I had a very strong experience of sexual temptation about this specific fetish , and so , although it has lost so much of its power . Sometimes I get hit by a trigger tornado or a shame storm or an extremely powerful attraction that seems to come out of nowhere , but for the most part it's not as difficult to deal with as it was before .

Speaker 1 3:13

Now , I didn't try to make this happen . I didn't intend to shift my sexual arousal template . I know many of you guys have asked can my arousal template shift ? Can my sexual attractions change ? Well , I believe that trying to alter sexual attraction is actually unethical and unhelpful . It's like trying to get rid of one of your emotions and if you want to heal and you want more integration , you need to get to know that part of you . You need to get to know your feelings and discover what's underneath them and , as a result , you may experience some amazing shifts . With that said , let me tell you the story of how my sexual fetish shifted over time .

Speaker 1 3:59

I believe there are

7 things that made my fetish less intense and powerful

Speaker 1 4:00

seven things that really helped me , and I didn't do these seven things necessarily trying to shift my sexual fetish or my fantasies or my arousal . My goal was healing and freedom from porn and along that journey , some of these actions that I took seemed to have a really wonderful effect . The seven things that really helped me are talking about the fetish , understanding the fetish , appreciating the fetish , acknowledging the fetish , completing the action , receiving the real thing and stopping the behavior . Let's start with talking about the fetish . I remember the first time I ever told someone about my sexual fetish for braces . I was terrified . I was terrified of being condemned , and when I told him that I was really turned on by races , he didn't think that was weird at all . He didn't feel toward me how I felt toward myself , and in that moment , and so many moments over and over again since then , I have realized that my deepest , darkest secrets do not disqualify me from being loved . This has created so much space Without the burden of shame and secrecy and self-condemnation . The sexual fetish didn't have as much power , which was wonderful , and I find that the more I can talk about these things , they lose their power , and maybe you're thinking to yourself oh , I've already done that .

Speaker 1 5:46

However , he told people about my specific fetish or my specific unwanted attractions but how specific did you get ? Because I find that each time I share , each time I talk about this stuff , I go a little deeper . I take a redemptive risk to share a little bit more than I did before , and each time I am met with love and acceptance , the healing sinks in and the sexual attraction gets a little bit less charged . Now it's not like I'm trying to shift my sexual attraction , but it just happens Because it's normalized . Instead of being this forbidden , magicalized secret , it's a normal part of life that we can just talk about and man that feels so good . That was the first thing that began to shift how I felt about my fetish . The second thing was understanding the fetish . This all started for me in 2015 when I watched a video by Patrick Carnes who talked about how your sexual development can get stunted , and when he said that I realized that's what happened to me at 13 years old . That was the time of life when all the other girls who I was interested in had braces . That was a huge contributor to why that fetish was so strong . Now . I still had those attractions even before that , but even just that understanding turned on a light bulb in my head and that really helped the fetish go from being this unknown , scary monster to something a lot more manageable . And that was just the start of my journey .

Speaker 1 7:31

As I continued into 2018 , I read the book Unwanted by Jay Stringer , and that also helped to put some pieces together and connect the dots between my sexuality and my story . Seeing where my sexual fetish came from was like turning on the lights inside my soul Before it was dark . I was scared . I didn't know what this thing was , where it came from , why it has so much power over me . It was like this big , scary monster . But when we flip on the lights , what I saw was a little boy who didn't get what he needed at a critical time of development , especially in puberty , and so this big , scary monster was actually more like a little mouse . If you've ever seen the Wizard of Oz , you know that when Dorothy and the Scarecrow and the Tin man and the Cowardly Lion finally find the Wizard , he seems like aw , it's the great and terrible . But then they pull back the curtain and they see a little man inside , and that's how I felt about my fetish . It was this big , great and terrible powerful force keeping me trapped in porn . But when I pulled back the curtain and I saw that little boy , little Drew , oh my goodness , myself , awareness , myself , compassion grew , and it has never stopped growing .

Speaker 1 8:54

Ever since 2015 , I've been continuing to learn about myself , especially by reading the book Unwanted by Jay Stringer . Going through his leadership training and now in husband material , even more layers are being uncovered . The more we can understand the connections between our sexuality and our story , you might find that things begin to shift . They feel less magical and more manageable , and I wish that understanding was enough , but unfortunately it's not . Many of you guys have begun to understand your brokenness , understand how your sexual development got hijacked by porn , by abandonment , abuse and measurement all the different layers of your story . And yet the pull of porn and the fascination of a fetish still feels really powerful . And that is often a hint that you need to take the next step , something that probably has helped me more than anything else Appreciating the fetish yes , appreciating it .

Speaker 1 10:00

And when I say appreciate the fetish , I'm specifically talking about appreciating the divine desire underneath the surface level arousal . So at the surface level I have this fetish for braces and orthodontics , but at the soul level there is a desire underneath that arousal for acceptance , for innocence , for connection , and that is what I have learned to bless . When you can bless your sexuality , you don't have to battle it anymore . When you can befriend the little boy who developed those feelings in the first place . It creates an amazing internal shift within yourself . You are no longer in fight , flight or freeze mode . You are no longer living in a cycle of fear , shame , arousal and self condemnation . Rather , you are living in love . You are living in appreciation , whether it's grief or joy , or both .

Speaker 1 11:10

My friend , when you can't appreciate what this attraction is trying to do , then you can actually work with it and lead it in a different direction . That's not destructive , that's not damaging . So I actually think if you find yourself having trouble letting go of a particular type of porn or a particular sexual fetish , maybe that part of you actually needs to be appreciated more , because there is something really good within it and it might take some digging to find what that good divine desire is . It has material . We can help you do that . And when you find that divine desire maybe multiple divine desires then you have something to embrace . Oh man , that just feels so good . You have something to say yes to . If you've been trying to say no , no , no , no to your fetish , what if you can find a way to say yes to the deeper desires underneath it ? It becomes a lot easier to let go of some of the old patterns and when those fetishes and fantasies come up again .

Speaker 1 12:29

Here is another action that has really helped me Simply noticing the fetish . This is also called mindfulness . Then a really strong , seemingly irresistible sexual thought comes up . Instead of fueling it and dwelling on it , instead of fighting it or trying to ignore it or avoid it , just being with it has such a powerful effect on your brain , on your body , on your whole system . So , in other words , if I see someone with braces , rather than just being aroused by that , I can be with the arousal . Here's what noticing the fetish sounds like Hmm , I'm feeling very aroused right now . Hmm , that person is really attractive , isn't that fascinating ? Wow , I'm feeling a really strong pull toward that . That's interesting .

Speaker 1 13:30

Non-judgmental observation has a way of defusing and draining the power out of some of our strongest sexual feelings , and this is a skill that you can use to manage any emotion . Instead of being angry , be with the anger . Instead of being anxious , be with your anxiety . This is a skill that you can develop and it works wonders . At this point , I've shared four out of the seven things that I believe shifted my sexual fetish over time . Again , my goal has been healing , not removing or replacing the fetish , but talking about it , understanding it , appreciating it and noticing it has given me a lot more love , joy , peace , health . Wholeness Like this is good stuff .

Speaker 1 14:23

Now there are three more things that I want to share that have created some very important shifts that are a little bit more difficult to talk about . The first one is completing the action . What do I mean by completing the action ?

Releasing trauma stored in your body

Speaker 1 14:40

Completing the action means releasing intense emotions and trauma that is stored in your body when extremely important events are interrupted , developmental milestones never get met . Remember when I said Patrick Carnes taught me that your sexual development can get stunted . Well , on the flip side , your sexual development can resume when you complete the interrupted action .

Speaker 1 15:10

For example , when I was a teenager , I had a series of almost girlfriends and it seemed like every time I got kind of close to getting into a relationship , I moved away , or they moved away , or something would happen and it would get cut off . Over the years , I've discovered that my sexual fetish for braces was actually calling me to complete the action . These relationships with these middle school girls were so good at the beginning but they got interrupted and that fetish was a way of saying , hey , there's this thing that you really need to do . And at the husband material leaders retreat in March , I finally did it . The very first girl who I ever had a crush on and really liked and she liked me back was a huge part of my origin story and why I had a thing for girls with braces . She had braces .

Speaker 1 16:17

And in March , at the husband material leaders retreat , I got to complete the action through a psychodrama process where I sat across from a man who was role-playing her . Her name was Katie and I got to tell her all of the things that I felt toward her that I never got to tell her . And I got to hold her hands and I looked into her eyes just through role-playing , but it felt so real and I said goodbye and I broke up with her and I just wept and sobbed and I got to say thank you . I got to say thank you for what you gave to me and the beauty and the connection that I felt with you . Oh , my goodness , I got to complete the action . I got to say what I never got to say . I got to do what I never got to do .

Speaker 1 17:09

How about you ? Where did your development get stunted ? Where did trauma leave you stuck , needing to complete a certain action , like connecting with your dad or standing up to the bullies or separating from your mom or escaping from an abuser that you never took , that you never had the opportunity to take . When you can pinpoint the parts of your story where you got stuck or where something very important was incomplete , that gives you a clue about what actions you can take to bring completion .

Speaker 1 17:46

And , man , that has really affected my sexual fetish . It doesn't feel the same way as it did before . I think part of that is because a fetish is inherently incomplete . It's partial , it's just a piece of a real person or a piece of a real relationship , not the full thing . And in full , beautiful , God-designed sexuality we are designed to be aroused by a complete experience , not just part of it , and a fetish is often times just a symbol or a representation of the real thing that we truly desire , that we truly need . So the next thing that has had a really big influence on the strength and power of my sexual fetish is receiving the real thing .

Speaker 1 18:34

I see this happening every year at the husband material retreat , especially for guys who experience same-sex attraction . They come to this retreat and they experience the connection and the brotherhood with men that they have desired . It's their divine desire and they're actually getting it in real life . It's amazing . It's like , wow , I sexualized this , but now I'm getting the non-sexual version of it and it's even better . Sometimes it's really triggering . It's like there's somebody who you are attracted to , yet through a real , authentic human connection that is safe and appropriate , you get the real thing , not just the symbolic sexual fetish version of it . This actually happened for me recently . I did not try to make this happen , it just happened and it was very healing .

Speaker 1 19:29

I was on an airplane coming back from that husband material leaders retreat where I finally broke up with that eighth grade girl I had loved all those years ago , feeling a tremendous release , feeling so much more complete On this airplane . I go to my seat , I sit down it's a middle seat and I'm very tall , so it's cramped and I get a tap on the shoulder . It turns out that somebody noticed me in my discomfort and offered for me to switch seats with somebody else in an exit row so I could have more space for my six foot seven inch body . Do you know who it was ? Can you guess what type of person noticed me in my uncomfortable state and invited me to sit next to her in the exit row where there was more space . It was a 15 year old girl who was riding on the airplane with her mother coming back from a volleyball tournament and , of course , she had braces . So here I am , sandwiched between this 15 year old girl and her mother on this airplane . I was speechless , I didn't know what to do . I was like this is so triggering and yet also somehow healing . And on this airplane ride I had a real time , real life conversation with a 15 year old girl with braces that was vulnerable . We both opened up in a very safe , appropriate way . Her mom was right there .

Speaker 1 21:05

I don't feel the need to include all the details of what happened here , but actually having a real conversation with the type of person who I had formerly objectified seemed to shift something . It was very strange to feel like I was living out something I had fantasized about . Yet there wasn't a sexual charge to it , it was normal , it was real life . And receiving the real thing in terms of having a safe , appropriate , healthy interaction with the type of person who I had formerly objectified affected me in a way that I still don't understand . Yet this is what I see often happening with husband , material men . Sometimes they find themselves interacting with somebody who historically , would have been the kind of person they would have pursued , and porn , and yet , through a redemptive risk and a healing experience and a safe environment , they get the real version , not the fake version .

Speaker 1 22:16

It's important to note that trying to force these experiences to happen is a bad idea . We can't do that . I don't think we should . What we can do is create space . For me , actually talking to this person on the airplane was an incredibly healing experience . I think God gave it to me . If I had tried to orchestrate that experience , it probably would have been part of some kind of addictive cycle . I actually don't think it would have been healthy for me to try to make that happen , but in the God-Orchestrated series of events it was perfectly safe , it was perfectly appropriate and it brought my healing that much deeper . It allowed me to encounter not just the part of a person that I had sexualized , it was humanizing and that's so beautiful . That has also created a shift in my sexual fetish .

Speaker 1 23:27

The last point I need to mention is deceptively simple stopping the behavior . What you feed grows and what you starve dies , the more fuel you give to a sexual fetish , either by indulging it or resisting it , the more it will grow . On the other hand , the more you talk about it , understand it , appreciate it , notice it and move on from it and let it go , then the less space it will take up , the less pain in your body , your heart , your mind . As simple as it may sound , the less time I've spent either indulging the fetish or trying really hard to avoid the fetish , the less space it has taken up in my life . Let me be clear it's not gone . It could return . Yet for the most part , my sexual fetish is less intense , less frequent , less disruptive and even less arousing . It has not been removed , it has not been replaced . It's not gone and sometimes it comes back very strongly .

Speaker 1 24:39

Let's pretend for a moment that my sexual fetish is a dog . I'm not saying the dog died . I'm not saying the dog became a cat . Rather , I'm saying that the fetish used to be like this big , scary guard dog and now it's like a small , friendly dog . Or you could say it used to be like a dog that was wounded and now it's been getting healthier . Or this is my favorite comparison you could say the fetish was like a little puppy that is finally now growing up into a mature adult dog . That's my favorite comparison . So the fetish did not get removed , it did not get replaced . It is not gone and sometimes it returns forcefully . And it has shifted . It's not like it used to be , and that's a beautiful thing

Summary of what helped me

Speaker 1 25:41

. Again , here's what made the difference for me Talking about it , understanding it , appreciating it , noticing it and being mindful of it , completing the interrupted actions , receiving the real thing instead of the fake sexual symbol and finally stopping the behavior .

Speaker 1 26:01

So if you want greater healing and freedom from porn , here's my best advice Be radically honest and vulnerable . Learn more about your sexual story , differentiate your sexual desire from your sexual arousal , practice mindfulness , non-judgmental observation , release intense emotions and trauma that you may be carrying . Receive the real thing of what you desire rather than the partial version of it represented or symbolized by a sexual fetish , and finally stop the unwanted behavior . Outgrow porn . Husband material is here to help . As a result , along this journey , you may experience a shift in what arouses you . Along the way , you may find that your sexual fetishes become less magical and more manageable , but that's not the goal . These things have really helped me and I believe they can help you too . Thank you for listening and always remember you are God's beloved Son , and in you he is well pleased .